tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post1873582680549903489..comments2023-05-27T11:14:02.426-04:00Comments on Some Space to Think: Some Notes and a QuestionAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14216103531396452644noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-15771731157414460042010-07-29T15:35:52.903-04:002010-07-29T15:35:52.903-04:00In my defense, Lame is different then Wrong, but I...In my defense, Lame is different then Wrong, but I understand your point. I guess I just want people to be excited about their aspects and it is hard to get excited about Strong.<br /><br />Circular argument though, I respectfully Bow Out, with sub clause of a restart of discussion next time I am in town :)Johnoghuehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09092967490495879598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-70900141004321515352010-07-29T09:45:34.223-04:002010-07-29T09:45:34.223-04:00@John Dude, yellow card. The idea that making a &q...@John Dude, yellow card. The idea that making a "Smart, Quick, Thief, Debts, Heart of Gold" is comparable to making "Drarry Hesden" is total strawman-ing.<br /><br />The trick is this: it's important to know why complex aspects are powerful and useful, but if you have that knowledge and go simple, more power to you. <br /><br />Plus, at some point someone may ask you the reasonable question "Aren't I making my aspect less useful by narrowing it down? A thief might be able to get a bonus to pickpocketing, but it's more of a stretch for a "Safecracker" or "Art Thief" and it's not like I get a _bigger_ bonus with safes or art." If the only answer you can give to that is "You should play better" then there's a problem.<br /><br />In the end, aspects are versatile. Simplicity may not be to _taste_, but it's very far from doing it wrong.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14216103531396452644noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-43400811428150300892010-07-28T15:10:33.187-04:002010-07-28T15:10:33.187-04:00Re: Simple aspects Vs Interesting aspects.
Aspect...Re: Simple aspects Vs Interesting aspects.<br /><br />Aspects are defining characteristics of your character. If you want to be Strong, well that is lame. There I said it.<br /><br />Yes you get more uses out of it, but that is not the point. If an aspect becomes a blanket statement it loses it's punch. <br /><br />Here is an example I use. If I have a player with the Thief aspect, I might ask "What Kind of thief?" If it's "second story man" well then Why not used that instead. <br /><br />If they are not sure, I might ask "What do you Steal" and I might get Art thief, which is at least a little better. <br /><br />If a player can't define what sort of thief they are, or can't come up with anything they have stolen, "Wannabe thief" Might be in order.<br /><br />I also try asking Why they took thief as well. Sometimes that clears it up.<br /><br />If they answer is Cause I wanted another aspect I could invoke when I am doing thief stuff, I get sad.<br /><br />Its like naming your Wizard Damian Helborn, or even Larry Thesden, Wizard PI. Unless you are being Ironic, it is Unoriginal and Boring.<br /><br />If you do it right you will never have aspects that don't inform the game. Will you invoke "Sucker for a Dame" in every challenge? Maybe not. But Would Rick be Rick without that aspect? Hell no. Does it inform his choices even when not directly in play? Heck yeah.<br /><br />So thats my 2 cents and I am spent.Johnoghuehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09092967490495879598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-64562206106149662432010-07-28T01:31:22.406-04:002010-07-28T01:31:22.406-04:00I like the idea of power coming from emotional lin...I like the idea of power coming from emotional links to people, ala Bliss Stage (or my imagined-yet-not-run Super Bliss Force Zeta), but just thought that perhaps it could be like relationships in Dogs in the Vineyard: People, Places, Organizations, or Sins. With all of those having a face you can talk to, naturally.<br /><br />(For those unfamiliar with Bliss Stage, your relationships are rated in terms of Intimacy and Trust, with Intimacy providing power and Trust providing resiliency.)Carl Rigneynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-30441143505361670222010-07-28T00:03:24.513-04:002010-07-28T00:03:24.513-04:00I'm gonna cast a vote for "something in t...I'm gonna cast a vote for "something in the Storytelling/Unisystem/L5R Stat+Skill spectrum." I don't fully understand how systems of that ilk can be compelling, and I'd learn a lot about that if we watched you design one.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-34534282031685485612010-07-27T22:58:15.248-04:002010-07-27T22:58:15.248-04:00a big yes to some light game design. Both things s...a big yes to some light game design. Both things sound interesting, but if the second option is going to be super generic, go for the Heartbreaker, if not, I don't have a preference. :)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02995467319902820342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-7773277038831352542010-07-27T18:50:11.424-04:002010-07-27T18:50:11.424-04:00Actually I fond the simpler Aspects easier to play...Actually I fond the simpler Aspects easier to play simply because they are easier to remember in the heat of the action. Obscure Aspects such as catch-phrases, look very interesting on the page of the character but can be very difficult for a gamemaster to remember and apply at the appropriate time.<br /><br />I think the solution is one more akin to that used in <i>Houses of the Blooded</i> where you get the players to write down what they feel are valid Invokes, Tags, Compels for their Aspect. If they can't provide a reasonable explanation for all three states then it is not really a valid Aspect.<br /><br />Whilst I don't expect either players or gamemasters to limit themselves to the Invokes, Tags and Compels they have specified (that would defeat creative game play), it does give everyone a strong idea of how the player wants to play the Aspect and how it can affect them in a negative way.<br /><br />As for your totally unrelated question, as a compulsive game collector I don't mind seeing any new game spring to light. Although I find I prefer simplicity over complexity when it comes to rule systems (this is in play; character creation is allowed to be quite complex). But everything is interesting.<br /><br />I do have the feeling you want people to vote for <i>Heartbreaker, the Fantasy RPG</i> so that's where my "vote" is going. Although that's simply because your idea is a bit more formed there, so it's something you've been thinking/wanting to do. <i><grin></i>Reverance Pavanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01217657347160811310noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-10713171575489305572010-07-27T16:42:01.704-04:002010-07-27T16:42:01.704-04:00I believe this is very much how Over the Edge nail...I believe this is very much how Over the Edge nails the Traits into "reality" as it were. You have to list some tag or flag or whatever they call it next to your Trait. I'm also reminded of the coolness of Feng Shui's multi-layered Skills, which we stole totally for LEVERAGE.Cam_Bankshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16162534181760938499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-3391987515316901052010-07-27T15:12:08.396-04:002010-07-27T15:12:08.396-04:00Awesome post. Any system with skills could actuall...Awesome post. Any system with skills could actually benefit from this.<br />I imagine it would work great with WoD.Stéphane Burahttp://www.stephanebura.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-68304081915495247662010-07-27T14:41:18.858-04:002010-07-27T14:41:18.858-04:00I wonder if the use of High Concept as Aspect alre...I wonder if the use of High Concept as Aspect already fills the role of the needed internal and abstract aspect, thus freeing the remaining Aspects to be tied directly to some external expression that can be better interfaced. Perhaps a bit of structuring to the High Concept, in the vein of Macklin's first Mythender character concept method of [Adjective] [Noun] [Prepositional Phrase] would give it enough girth to encompass most ideas.<br /><br />Well, I am always eager to read about game design so yes, I would find it worth reading. <br /><br />As for system choices, I am incredibly fond of the 7th Sea way of handling magic and sword styles, but Unisystem (Angel and Armageddon in particular) have done well in my experience.Dave Bozarthhttp://www.twitter.com/DaveBozarthnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-43955018707766292112010-07-27T14:32:21.483-04:002010-07-27T14:32:21.483-04:00what if all aspects were other people, places and ...what if all aspects were other people, places and things and none of them were internal or descriptive?<br /><br />Well, what about a hybrid approach? As said upstream, abstract aspects are useful for character development, but external, concrete ones are ones that GMs can develop plot around.<br /><br />So, suggest to players to have a balance of both abstract and external aspects.<br /><br />As far as external expression, and abilities (Ninja Teacher==Ninja skills), that starts to blend into PDQ, doesn't it?Paul Weimerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02444942522624902562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-29654846220704768532010-07-27T14:10:09.448-04:002010-07-27T14:10:09.448-04:00So Maybe I am the odd duck but I don't let Wiz...So Maybe I am the odd duck but I don't let Wizard, Fighter, Ninja, or the like fly as aspects any more then I do Strong, Tough, Or Fast Etc. <br /><br />Is it heavy handed to lean on a player to come up with a better aspect? Maybe, but usually it can be done as part of the Character Creation process and makes a better character with a more invokable aspect. <br /><br />Pilot to "Any landing you can walk away from." Ninja to "Scion of the Grey Fox Clan." Wizard to "Necromancer Extraordinare!"<br /><br />I feel that the books activly Encourage the playful and descriptive aspects, but doesn't require it. I do though and I think that helps solve some of the tagging problem.<br /><br />A note: I Like the 7th Sea over L5R, despite their similarities. I like the Swashbuckling flavor of getting stabbed and getting a Dramatic Wound, yet still fighting on vs L5R where you get Stabbed and Die.Johnoghuehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09092967490495879598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-52246829096306757612010-07-27T13:58:49.364-04:002010-07-27T13:58:49.364-04:00Answers - Yes to it being worth reading, so write ...Answers - Yes to it being worth reading, so write about it! As far as between which of those two ideas, I'm more up in the air on that so I can't offer a suggestion, sorry!Bartoneushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04788256492505323850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-36806160718439649702010-07-27T11:43:29.792-04:002010-07-27T11:43:29.792-04:00Yeah, I would strongly suggest that there's a ...Yeah, I would strongly suggest that there's a one to many relationship between an aspect and its anchors.Fredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08362641974657304051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-77775040563172454372010-07-27T11:17:31.813-04:002010-07-27T11:17:31.813-04:00@fred Yeah, there's definitely mileage in abst...@fred Yeah, there's definitely mileage in abstract aspects, but they end up having an indirect impact, which makes them a bit rougher to create an economnic churn off of (though as an aside, I don't push for many rolls in play, so that is the other side of that equation). <br /><br />The rub, I think, is that we (and I so very include myself here) are fond of clever wordplay, sometimes to the point of undercutting the power of the underlying idea. Not always, but enough that I notice it at times. For cases like that, I like the idea of the Anchor as a clear, player directed pointer at the kind of thing they were thinking of. <br /><br />(Though that reminds me that an important point of Anchors is that they're exemplary, not exclusive.)<br /><br />-Rob D.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14216103531396452644noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-40559263611070797152010-07-27T11:03:35.534-04:002010-07-27T11:03:35.534-04:00I third the interest in the "Fantasy Heartbre...I third the interest in the "Fantasy Heartbreaker", although it would be more interesting to me if we pretended some fantasy RPG other than D&D had dominated the field.John Hhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17221852540168737900noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-39126998637782158222010-07-27T10:47:59.561-04:002010-07-27T10:47:59.561-04:00I second the interest in seeing the "Fantasy ...I second the interest in seeing the "Fantasy Heartbreaker" work, though any kind of light game design would be neat :)highbulp (aka, Joel)https://www.blogger.com/profile/03830016579597691953noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-18818287830588972402010-07-27T10:43:42.259-04:002010-07-27T10:43:42.259-04:00One perspective on abstract aspects is that they a...One perspective on abstract aspects is that they are themes which should show up outside of the character in hownthings develop in play. Much like the tv show thing where both the a plot and the b plot are about the same theme, but expressed in different ways due to the character in focus. A plot is the pc with the aspect, b plot is some externality.Fredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08362641974657304051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-72978782681572656402010-07-27T10:20:07.847-04:002010-07-27T10:20:07.847-04:00Light Game Design = Yaaaaas. Would like to see.Light Game Design = Yaaaaas. Would like to see.Chad Underkofflerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03490777597321061502noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1678761812929125529.post-80400425017987108842010-07-27T10:15:49.406-04:002010-07-27T10:15:49.406-04:00I, for one, would definitely be interested in seei...I, for one, would definitely be interested in seeing some light game design here.<br /><br />I think I would lean toward seeing a "Fantasy Heartbreaker", largely because I would prefer to see linkages to genre than general system work.Doc Bluehttp://docblue.posterous.comnoreply@blogger.com